Shineray piston and crankshaft for AX-1 / NX 250

[lbel67]

Yes, will re-confirm with them tomorrow and let you know. I had mine ringed some seven eight years ago (or perhaps more, I can't remember) and when I checked the con rod (when converted to 249cc) the ring was in an unexpectedly good condition and within spec after more than 50,000 km. I will try to post a photo tomorrow. I replaced the conrod with a Samarin, which required a slight mod (internal milling) of the piston (made by the same workshop), as the samarin is a little bit wider in upper eye. Have clocked more than 70,000 km with the samarin without any noticeable problem. Pity they closed the operation.

[scrambler]

I replaced the conrod with a Samarin, which required a slight mod (internal milling) of the piston (made by the same workshop), as the samarin is a little bit wider in upper eye. Have clocked more than 70,000 km with the samarin without any noticeable problem.

It sounds really good. Samarin conrods were also used by one or two people here in the forum at the time (without known long-term experience). There was also a German supplier Mehl who sold new NX250 conrods as "reworked" Peugeot conrods, but they looked exactly like the Samarin ones. Which raises the question: if Samarin made the conrods specifically for the NX250, why didn't they fit? I suspect that Samarin used conrods from another engine. Unfortunately, I haven't figured out which engine it could be from yet—certainly not Peugeot, since their car conrods have lower split eyes.


pic from viewtopic.php?p=1575#p1575

[kuroguro]

Unfortunately, I haven't figured out which engine it could be from yet—certainly not Peugeot, since their car conrods have lower split eyes.

I doubt it's from a car? Peugeot also made scooters and mopeds. Samarin's website/pdf also has some. I don't see any that match the dimensions tho.

~edit~

While searching for the source of Samarin by dimensions I found this oddity:

https://www.tienda.wstandard.com.ar/MLA ... creuso-_JM

Argentinians have cloned the Shineray clone conrod? It is marked "creuso" on the side so it is likely a custom part. At first the picture did not inspire confidence however after looking into it the company behind it is "Alen Creuso" which seems somewhat reputable? Hard to say. At least it is a custom machine shop. Their website does not work at the moment, a catalog from the archive lists the NX and multiple clones.

https://web.archive.org/web/20211209172 ... talogo.pdf

ceruso.png

[scrambler]

I doubt it's from a car? Peugeot also made scooters and mopeds. Samarin's website/pdf also has some. I don't see any that match the dimensions tho.

Yes, Peugeot built 50-125cc scooters, and their connecting rods are too small. I googled a lot for 112mm conrods (actually 112.5mm long, but that gives more results) – but I never found anything except Chinese stuff.

Argentinians seem to have cloned the Shineray clone conrod?

I found those while Googling. They're also Chinese conrods, and I don't really feel like testing them. But if anyone wants to try it out

We might have found another solution – someone on the forum knows a company in Greece that fits the upper connecting rod eye with a bronze bushing. I'll give that a try, but the engine probably won't be running until 2026.

[kuroguro]

I thought they were Chinese at first glance too, but from the catalog you can see their name on almost all of the conrods. Would making custom molds for just the name be worth it? It is possible but I'm not sure.

Yes, trying them is another question - quality is unknown and I'm not sure I trust Argentina more than China. I just thought I would list it for reference.

We might have found another solution – someone on the forum knows a company in Greece that fits the upper connecting rod eye with a bronze bushing. I'll give that a try, but the engine probably won't be running until 2026.

At least some good news

~edit~

Street view also seems to match machine shop pictures from catalog/social media. Of course this does not prove the conrods are made there but it seems likely.

curesso2.jpg

[scrambler]

I thought they were Chinese at first glance too, but from the catalog you can see their name on almost all of the conrods. Would making custom molds for just the name be worth it?

Well observed! Then they were actually specially manufactured and should fit. I asked in the Facebook group if anyone has already tested them. There are a few NX250 fans from Argentina there.

[kuroguro]

I found a better picture of the Creuso, I don't know what they did with the first one, it looked terrible.

creusoHD.png

They have a smaller website with just the products now: https://alencreuso.mitiendanube.com/
Prices seem cheaper than the resellers on the markets. The NX conrod is not currently listed and they don't have shipping options out of the country on the site. If anyone wants to try this one day you would have to contact them or set up reshipping somehow.


About the exploding Chinese "KW3-1" conrod, it seems to be made by Hanfan Technology (Benma Group).
https://www.alibaba.com/product-detail/ ... 74984.html

They offer repacking and branding as needed for large orders hence the multiple brands everywhere. At the bottom of their English website they have a table for aftermarket parts for a lot of small cc Japanese bikes. Most of the parts (including the NX conrod) aren't listed there atm. This probably isn't particularly useful to anyone, I just want to make sure which shop makes what

https://www.motorcycle-clutchassembly.c ... otorc.html

hanfan.jpg

Lastly about the clones - I hadn't seen it mentioned here, but there is an old chinariders post from when the engines were released that mentions Yingang's website having pictures with Shineray branded engines. This likely confirms that they are made in the same factory and have the exact same parts. I would like to think it's the same story with Dongben as the engine appeared around the same time.
https://www.chinariders.net/archive/ind ... -8171.html

[scrambler]

I found a better picture of the Creuso, I don't know what they did with the first one, it looked terrible.

It looks like the ring of the upper eye is thicker, which isn't bad for durability. Judging by the color of the needle bearing, it's silver-plated— better than the copper cages of the Chinese bearings. I've seen those in silver, too, by the way. However, I have not found anyone yet who has tested the creuso conrods. Maybe you can order it here https://listado.mercadolibre.com.ar/biela-honda-nx-250

This likely confirms that they are made in the same factory and have the exact same parts.

The magic word is quality control. Perhaps they sold rejects as aftermarket parts I can't explain this conrod any other way. The upper eye is so out of round that it isn't completely ground.

Someone wrote on Facebook that the Chinese conrods would hold if they were hard chrome-plated, otherwise the upper eye would quickly wear out. But you would have to buy half a dozen conrods, measure them precisely, and then have the good ones hard chrome-plated.

[kuroguro]

The magic word is quality control. Perhaps they sold rejects as aftermarket parts I can't explain this conrod any other way. The upper eye is so out of round that it isn't completely ground.

No no, I was trying to say the regular (Hanfan?) Chinese conrods are made as aftermarket parts for the NX (as they do for many Japanese bikes) at a different factory and have nothing to do with the clones. Of course this is only guessing. I don't have good data for Yingang or Dongben.

Either way - it does not matter, Yingang and Dongben have not done anything with the clones for many years so only Shineray parts remain.

hafan-shineray.jpg

-edit-

Here is a bad picture of a Yingang (Patron Taker 250) in parts. The bottom of the conrod near the crank is smooth like the Shineray, not with a step like the Hanfan.
https://www.avito.ru/gorodovikovsk/zapc ... 2145111060

taker.jpg

-edit-

And for completeness here is another bad picture of a Egl MadMax 300 ATV which is most likely from Dongben (same cover design and there were also some mentions on German forums somewhere). Clones all seem to use same smooth conrod, I think?
https://fastbox.su/pl-1/product/9010871031

madmax-dongben.jpg

-edit-

Found a closeup of a Shineray conrod stamped "XIE MA S3...", the clones all use Xiema crankshaft company! I don't think they sell their parts separately tho.
https://tw.bid.yahoo.com/item/101612563186
https://en.xiema.com/products_list/2.html


Lastly I had some thoughts on the Samarin mystery (sorry for all the spam )

From what I can tell from pictures the NX conrod is fully made by Samarin. The design, finish (plating?) and stamped "S" all match other conrods they make. So I don't see how this connects to a reworked Peugeot currently. Unless they had one they never listed. Here are some good Samarin pictures: https://www.pvlsverige.se/vrm/samecm/samecm.html
I found an older 2006 catalog in which the NX is missing. Between the current 2010 catalog and the product ID in the url which is one of the last added (1538 of 1548 for 2010) we can guess it got created around 2010 most likely.

samarin.jpg

Also all other Samarin conrods I have seen have a flat head, not tapered. And none of them have notches on the top. Maybe the tools they use did not support taper? This would explain the weird drilled notches on the top - to add clearance for a (tapered?) piston.
Since the OEM doesn't fit either someone sent in rough measurements and never reported a problem back or... it was made to fit some other "NX" piston?

The Shinerays were available around 2010. I am just wondering if you ever tried fitting the "Mehl" into any of the Chinese pistons or if any of them have a bit more space? I suppose the chance that it fits is slim but I am curious.

Anyway, this is mostly speculation, feel free to ignore

[scrambler]

Wow, that's some research, fun to read. If you keep it up, you'll find other available conrods from replica engines . Actually, conrod construction isn't rocket science; it should be possible outside of Japan too. Japan, by the way - it's surprising that they never had aftermarket conrods there (?) The AX1 was sold very frequently there and is now a sought-after collector's item. They made the same mistake as the Americans: when interest in buying them waned, they exported them (used) by the container, and now they hardly have any left .

As for the so-called Peugeot conrod from Mehl: I never believed it. Engine manufacturers are sometimes (for whatever reason) reluctant to disclose the source of their parts. The best example: a very reputable engine rebuilder had pistons for the NX250 available. The picture looks exactly like the one on Aliexpress: https://www.scheuerlein-motorentechnik. ... 0-modelle/ So it can only be a Chinese piston; no one would have pistons specially cast for such a rare motorcycle. Perhaps he tested and measured the pistons and found them to be satisfactory – unfortunately, he wasn't willing to reveal the pistons' origin, only that they meet the highest quality standards. Interestingly, he offers piston rings for the 239cc pistons that aren't available anywhere else, not even in China? I'd ask him where he got them, but I probably won't get an answer either .

In terms of their composition and quality, our piston rings are among the technically best currently available on the market.

As engine rebuilders, we know what we're talking about.

NX250 kolben.jpg

But back to the Samarin conrod – I think the story about the Peugeot conrod is made up; it must have been a Samarin. And then Mehl got a slap on the head from the customers because the NX250 pistons didn't fit. There was another reason for slapping: there was at least one known case where he bent the crankshaft while pressing it out, so it doesn't seem to be that simple either. He then soon took the connecting rods out of the range again.

Why the Samarin conrods are wider at the top remains a mystery. Did they also have matching pistons manufactured? But there's no evidence of that. The Chinese pistons also—from what I've seen—only fit the NX conrods.

If I ever win the lottery I will have Carrillo produce H shaft premium steel conrods and Wössner 71mm pistons